Discussion in "General help Guidance and Discussion" started by    MrZappy    May 13, 2010.
Thu May 13 2010, 02:55 AM
#1
Hi all, I am a 1st year University Student pursuing a degree in electronics engineering. I am very interested to learn about embedded systems as it is in my syllabus however I find myself being stuck and confused. I hope I can learn most of it before the next semester starts.

1. The main question I have is the difference between 8051, AVR, PIC and Motorola's 68HC11. What is AVR by the way? I know it is manufactured by Atmel but that's all I know. Only the 8051 and 8085 is within my syllabus. Therefore I am more interested to learn up these two types.

2. Is it possible to purchase the necessary components to assemble your own 8051 board at home? I plan to invest a little cash to play with the board at home. Do they come in DIP? Because SMD insn't an option as I don't have the necessary skills to solder it on.

3. Can the 8051 drive motors like the PIC and AVR? Basically, can it do what the other chips can do? What about 8085 then?

4. The language to learn. I understand some language are chip specific. So, how do I go about learning them. I read through the sticky at the start of this forum regarding 8051. It mentions learning up C and using Proteus for simulation. Is this the standard way?

5. Is there any noticeable difference between Intel's 8051 and Atmel's 8051? I understand the technology came from Intel first but what I want to know is whether they are interchangeable. Because I think Intel's 8051 only comes in SMD form whereas Atmel's 8051 comes in DIP. I want to get something that I can experiment at home.

6. I am also interested in robot building. Can I provide the brains of the robot in the form of 8051 or 8085? Because those are the major stuffs that I learn about, I would prefer to use as opposed to PIC. Besides, I heard the 8085 has much more memory capacity as it uses external RAM. Is this true? And can I drive motors with 8051 and 8085? More importantly, can I build the 8085 in the first place?

Thank you for taking the time to read through my post.


[ Edited Thu May 13 2010, 02:56 AM ]
Fri May 14 2010, 12:28 PM
#2

1. The main question I have is the difference between 8051, AVR, PIC and Motorola's 68HC11. What is AVR by the way? I know it is manufactured by Atmel but that's all I know. Only the 8051 and 8085 is within my syllabus. Therefore I am more interested to learn up these two types.

MrZappy


8051, AVR PIC and 68HC11 all are different architectures so they all have different type of working and features.. i think it can be explained better on its own if you understand the difference between Intel Processor and AMD processor.
if you need more information on this better download User manuals for all architectures and read through.

2. Is it possible to purchase the necessary components to assemble your own 8051 board at home? I plan to invest a little cash to play with the board at home. Do they come in DIP? Because SMD insn't an option as I don't have the necessary skills to solder it on.

MrZappy


Yes its very much possible. You can make a good development board at home itself. needs very less components to start with. If you need more information you can ask for it. And i will surely suggest you DIP packages as for a newbie they are easy to handle
BUT you must have some knowledge of soldering components. if you dont have, then try buying a simple solder gun and start practicing

3. Can the 8051 drive motors like the PIC and AVR? Basically, can it do what the other chips can do? What about 8085 then?

MrZappy


8051 can do almost everything a PIC or AVR can do
8085 is an exception as 8051,PIC and AVR are in category of controllers whereas 8085 is a Processor like 8086 or Intel Core2 Duo

4. The language to learn. I understand some language are chip specific. So, how do I go about learning them. I read through the sticky at the start of this forum regarding 8051. It mentions learning up C and using Proteus for simulation. Is this the standard way?

MrZappy


Well language is always your choice. If you are a starter i recommend to try hands on assembly (chip specific) first and then move to C (easily portable) slowly. coz assembly helps you build your basics.

Proteus is a simulation software in which you can test your code without need of a hardware. Its really a good software and saves lot of cost you spend on hardware prototyping and stuff.
I recommend using Proteus only after you have tried your hands once on a real hardware so that you understands the bottlenecks faced in working on a real hardware than a software.

5. Is there any noticeable difference between Intel's 8051 and Atmel's 8051? I understand the technology came from Intel first but what I want to know is whether they are interchangeable. Because I think Intel's 8051 only comes in SMD form whereas Atmel's 8051 comes in DIP. I want to get something that I can experiment at home.

MrZappy



Surely there will be difference in ICs from vendor to vendor but architecture is going to remain same i.e. code you written for Intel's 8051 will work on Atmel's 8051 too. only difference going to be is features.
i explain it better with an example of a washing machine, basic job is a washing machine is to wash cloths which will remain same, no matter its a Whirlpool or Samsung or LG etc. but every company will give features of their own

to experiment at home i suggest you go for NXP's P89V51RD2 there are many features in this IC which will help you start learning faster and better

6. I am also interested in robot building. Can I provide the brains of the robot in the form of 8051 or 8085? Because those are the major stuffs that I learn about, I would prefer to use as opposed to PIC. Besides, I heard the 8085 has much more memory capacity as it uses external RAM. Is this true? And can I drive motors with 8051 and 8085? More importantly, can I build the 8085 in the first place?

MrZappy


yes 8051 is perfect for starters. 8085 is just a processor and has no memory or port and not recommended for robot building. 8051 can drive motors easily.
8085 has lot to do when building a prototype board, as you will need lot of external components memory, ports etc. whereas 8051 has its own onchip memory and ports with many other features like uart, timers etc.

You can start your embedded journey with 8051 and we are here for help enjoy learning
Fri May 14 2010, 07:30 PM
#3
Thanks! I really appreciate your reply. So, how do I begin my journey into 8051? I would prefer if I could learn the theories and test it out practically at the same time. It would be more insightful to actually see a blinking LED rather than understand that it will blink. So, how do I make my own board, programmer... ect?
Mon May 17 2010, 07:39 PM
#4
Sorry for late reply. well.. bill of material for your own board is very less.

The main components are:
1. P89V51RD2 - 8051 controller
2. Max232 - RS232 interface driver
3. Crystal - 11.0592Mhz

apart from this you need some passive components. well till i make a simple schematic for you, you can go out and look for these components in market. I am sure you will get them easily.

additionally you will need a breadboard for your testing purpose.

Good Luck!

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